Can not chance limit entry price. Log included

[NetTecture]

Hello,

similar problem than the one with the stop, just this time I can not easily work around it.

I try to enter a position (HA4 L) with a limit price. It is not filled, insted the straetgy decides to scrap long entries. THis is the corresponding entry:

Cancelled custom managed order at 24/07/2009 15:44:16: Order='NT-00023/Sim101' Name='HA4 L' State=Working Instrument='YM 09-09' Action=Buy Limit price=8981 Stop price=0 Quantity=1 Strategy='HeinekenAshiReversal' Type=Limit Tif=Gtc Oco='' Filled=0 Fill price=0 Token='d7b00f76cb56455fb208d3a8ee319601' Gtd='01/12/2099 00:00:00'

I shows clearly a HA4 L order existed and was attempted to be cancelled.

At a later stage, I am trying to establish a new position. This is the next time HA4 L appeard in the tace. It is ignored, resulting in a strategy crash:

24/07/2009 16:00:04 Entered internal PlaceOrder() method at 24/07/2009 16:00:04: Action=Buy OrderType=Limit Quantity=1 LimitPrice=8967 StopPrice=0 SignalName='HA4 L' FromEntrySignal=''
24/07/2009 16:00:04 Ignored PlaceOrder() method at 24/07/2009 16:00:04: Action=Buy OrderType=Limit Quantity=1 LimitPrice=8967 StopPrice=0 SignalName=HA4 L' FromEntrySignal='' Reason='An Enter() method to submit an entry order has been ignore. Please search on the term 'Internal Order Handling Rules' in the Help Guide for detailed explanation.'

Is this the same error? Is your advice again to move the limit somewhere it does not disturb? (i.e. far far out)?

[NinjaTrader_Bertrand]

NetTecture, I believe this is the same issue you ran into yesterday, can you try to resubmit it the limit order again to change the entry price?

[NetTecture]

I think the same.

Sadly at this point I can not resubmit.

Last time, the scenario for me indeed was the adjustment of a stop loss price.

This time we talk of entering a new position. In fact, the complete log shows that between the cancel and the reentry, an opposite positoin was opened.

As such, the cancel of the open order is "valid". There is no price adjustment scenario from my side.

I normally open 3 positions at market, and one to add slightly against my price. This often does not get triggered - and needs to be closed.

I theoretically could move the price way off, but this would need to be tracked, order reuse be coded in etc. - a lot of work for basically something that should be fixed from your end. And my trade manager is already a lot more complicated than the trading decisions per se.

Sorry to say, but acknowledged bug (if it is the same thing - which I also believe) in something THAT critical (i.e. not a funny graphics appearing - we talk of order handling, pretty much the absolute core of what NinjaTrader does) are not something I want to see fixed in a NT7 that is half a year away, it is something I personally, as customer, expect to be pushed up to CEO level and fixed NOW with a release.

[NinjaTrader_Bertrand]

NetTecture, I'll review this with Josh when he gets in and let you know, basically with your scale in / scale out approach you would oftentimes run into the 'Order handling rules' as you already experienced - so probably best is to wait for the 'Unmanaged Order Submission' feature included in NinjaTrader 7 which will give you more flexibility for such strategies.

[NetTecture]

Yes. And now.

So far it works pretty well. I had to make a lot of workaround, but it is a lot more because you do not expose the signals as "positions" yourself, so I now have a TradeManager that returs me a Position object. This allows me to actually track those sub-positions effectively. Anything else works pretty well. I somehow like it, actually. It is not that bad, once one gets around the fact that debugging it is a little painfull

What we have here now is purely an error. If I cancel a signal order, I expect to be able to resubmit it. Especially if that happens over some time. None of your rules say I am not allowed to cancel orders and resubmit them, and in case of the stop that was said to be a bug - if you remember.

Bugs should be fixed. Uless you work with market orders, there is nothing that says that a signal entry will fill - acutally I would expect most not to. As such, canceling a signal entry order and being able to resubmit that is a MUST.

Thanks for taking that up

[NinjaTrader_JoshP]

All bugs are taken very seriously and are always addressed as quickly as possible. As discussed, cancelling stop and resubmitting is a bug which will be fixed in NT7.

Note that this is NOT the same error. You not being able to resubmit is due to a break of the order handling rules. You will need to isolate out which rule happened to be broken at the time.

[NetTecture]

Whow. If I would not have gotten an answer from your CEO regarding toning down my posts I would have given you an appropriate answer now.

You are aware that "taken seriously fixed ASAP" and a 6 month timeframe in a major release make this answer something to post no a website deadling with customer service, right?

For now it means I can not implemnet a trading strategy because the extremely complicated and arcane element of cancelling an order is beyond the functionality of NinjaTrader.

This IS funny.

Well, looks like I have to cope with it from my side. Which means using NT for manual order entry, and moving to a competitor for automatism. I am sort of not willing to wait 6 months for - well - you know. Cancelling an order.

Can not say it different. Your software has great potential. But then the advanced features are broken. Stuff like cancelling an order.

[sefstrat]

NetTecture, are you using the standard order entry method or the lower level IOrder interface?

Cancelling, modifying, resubmitting limit orders all work here using IOrder system (which I would definitely recommend you use if you are going to do limit orders in your strategy)

I agree with your qualms about the order system though. The order handling rules are illogical and poorly documented IMO, especially the IOrder stuff. Not to mention its extremely painful to debug since remotesoft protector precludes you from using visual studio (when code from inside NinjaTrader.Core is causing you problems)

Hopefully this will get addressed with NT7..

[NetTecture]

The only thing I do that requires IOrder is the CancelOrder . In general, I use the returned IOrder to move fills back to the corresponding signal-position in my trade manager.

Iok with up to 7 different signals. So, i need to track what is filled, what is trailing, what got closed out as well as cancel all pending orders when in the way.

What other methods do I have that use IOrder? I am only aware of CancelOrder that TAKES an IOrder.

[NinjaTrader_JoshP]

CancelOrder methods are the only ones that use IOrders as a parameter besides the obvious OnOrderUpdate().